[talk-ch] Addresses and all that ... (GWR)

Olivier Chatelain olivier.chatelain at gmail.com
Thu Mar 1 14:13:47 CET 2018


Q:
- Will you talk to the guys of "Regio-Osm" to integrate the data?

===

Still working hard for Bern, my recommendations:

Map Style

- Colored Streets


Plugins:

1) Conflation: Merge von Daten aus Layern

2) utilsplugin2: Gebäude mit Linie und Alt-X teilen

3) Terracer: mit Shift-T in n-Teile teilen

3) ToDo-List: Offene Split's "by the merge" markieren


Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch> schrieb am Do., 1. März 2018 um 12:37 Uhr:

> And just in case you didn't have enough of me posting on this topic :-)
>
> The current address counts on a per canton base:
> http://qa.poole.ch/addresses/ch_canton would seem to indicate that we are
> noe over 50% for Berne.
>
> Simon
>
>
>
> Am 28.02.2018 um 23:49 schrieb Simon Poole:
>
> BTW since the beginning of 2018 all the address data in the Kanton Zürich
> is available on a CC0 licence which from a pure legal pov is un-problematic
> (IMHO we should complete the Canton Berne before we overreach by trying to
> do too many things at the same time).
>
> Simon
>
> On 28.02.2018 20:59, Olivier Chatelain wrote:
>
> Thanks for keeping the topic warm. - Good luck!
>
> Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch> schrieb am Mi., 28. Feb. 2018 um 19:13 Uhr:
>
>> Short update:
>>
>> the BfS has now changed the text distributed for the third time since
>> release (in December), it now includes an attribution requirement that
>> previously wasn't there. As you may know we can't offer downstream
>> attribution in OSM and I've asked the BfS if they could agree to
>> attribution on the wiki page as I've already mentioned.previously
>>
>> I don't expect an answer before the 2nd week of March, so we will just
>> have to wait a bit more.
>>
>> Simon
>>
>> On 30.01.2018 21:49, Simon Poole wrote:
>>
>> Wiki page:
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Contributors
>>
>> The disclaimer is semi-nonsense and just restates on the base of which
>> ordinance they are making the data available at all (it is not as if
>> they were not allowed to define ToU for data of access type A, that's is
>> what swisstopo has done for years, and you wouldn't say that swisstopo
>> has been breaking the law all the time, or would you? :-)) , I would
>> take it essentially as do what you like with it. probably when the
>> "official" dataset from swisstopo becomes available it will be on
>> different terms.
>>
>> Simon
>>
>>
>> Am 30.01.2018 um 18:34 schrieb marc marc:
>>
>> Simon which wiki page are you talking about?
>>
>> I didn't understand what the Disclaimer meant to an osm contributor.
>>
>> For postal codes and cities, I think we should also ask ourselves
>> how we want to use them.
>> do we want to duplicate them everywhere on all objects?
>> the best way would be to use this data to build the missing boundary.
>>
>> Le 30. 01. 18 à 18:30, Stefan Keller a écrit :
>>
>> 2018-01-30 10:46 GMT+01:00 Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch> <simon at poole.ch>:
>>
>> The main question is if we should do something with the PLZ6 digits or just forget about them.
>>
>> But you keep the PLZ4? Since Nominatim recently supports them even better [1].
>>
>> :Stefan
>>
>>
>> [1] https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/lonvia/diary/43143
>>
>> 2018-01-30 10:46 GMT+01:00 Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch> <simon at poole.ch>:
>>
>> @All I've tried to pry something more concrete on the usage terms from our
>> contact at the BfS, however this has proven to be more difficult than I
>> assumed (or maybe not). In any case the text that is currently pointed to is
>>
>> Disclaimer DE
>> Gemäss Art. 16 der Verordnung über das eidgenössische Gebäude- und
>> Wohnungsregister vom 1. Juli 2017 (VGWR; SR 431.841) veröffentlicht das BFS
>> die Daten der Berechtigungsstufen A im Internet. Die Bereitstellung der
>> Strassen und der Gebäudeadressen (beide Stufe A) erfolgt gemäss Art. 26a und
>> 26c der Verordnung über die geografischen Namen vom 21. Mai 2008 (GeoNV; SR
>> 510.625) durch swisstopo. Das BFS teilt swisstopo die Daten und periodisch
>> alle Änderungen mit (Art. 26a Abs. 3 und 26c Abs. 2 GeoNV).
>>
>> Die amtlichen Verzeichnisse der Strassen (Art. 26a GeoNV) und der
>> Gebäudeadressen (Art. 26c GeoNV) werden aktuell vorbereitet und treten
>> schrittweise bis spätestens 1. Juli 2021 in Kraft (Art. 37a GeoNV).
>>
>> Um den Zugang zu diesen Daten auch während der Übergangszeit zu ermöglichen,
>> kümmert sich das BFS um eine Zwischenlösung. Es ist ein Zugriff auf die
>> Daten in Listenform möglich, wobei die Bereitstellung grundsätzlich gemäss
>> Art. 26a und 26b GeoNV erfolgt. Diese Listen sind für die Behörden
>> unverbindlich. Nur die von swisstopo erstellten und in Betrieb genommenen
>> amtlichen Verzeichnisse der Strassen und Gebäudeadressen sind
>> behördenverbindlich
>>
>> There have been some hints that we should provide attribution which I would
>> suggest we do, as customary, on the Contributors wiki page.
>>
>> Further note: I've included GWR extracts in OSM format as described below:
>> http://qa.poole.ch/addresses/GWR/n.osm.zip
>>
>> The main question is if we should do something with the PLZ6 digits or just
>> forget about them.
>>
>> SImon
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 21.12.2017 um 10:01 schrieb Simon Poole:
>>
>>
>> I've re-projected the data and split it up in to municipalities, you can get
>> the zipped ESRI shapefile from
>> http://qa.poole.ch/addresses/GWR/n.zip
>>
>> by replacing n with the BfS municipality number.
>>
>> Notes:
>> a) as already said the use terms are not quite clear right now, and likely
>> won't be before Christmas, but obviously you can familiarize yourself with
>> the data now. Quality seems to vary a bit, in principle the nodes should be
>> where the entrances are, but obviously in many cases that is only very rough
>> b) what we want to do with the data in the end is unclear, and likely this
>> will have to be decided on canton by canton
>> c) if we decide to import the data we need to follow the import process
>> d) we are already importing the address data from the Canton of Berne, and
>> it would likely be helpful to finish that off before embarking on any thing
>> new
>>
>> Simon
>>
>> Am 19.12.2017 um 18:19 schrieb Simon Poole:
>>
>> I had contact with the BfS yesterday and clear terms of use should be
>> forthcoming.
>>
>> If I get around to it before Christmas, I'll see if I can produce a version
>> of the data re-projected to WGS84 coordinates.
>>
>> Simon
>>
>>
>>
>> On 16. Dezember 2017 15:00:14 MEZ, Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch> <simon at poole.ch> wrote:
>>
>> I was originally going to remind everybody, particularly those resident
>> in the canton Berne, that we have an ongoing project to import addresses
>> and trace buildings that is not complete yethttp://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Canton_of_Bern_Address_Import and
>> then I was going to point out that besides the addresses from the canton
>> of Zürich that will become available at the beginning of January, that
>> from our correspondence with the BfS we would be expecting the first
>> address data from the GWR to be available for download in the next
>> quarter too.
>>
>> However yesterday we were a bit surprised by the announcement that data
>> from the GWR would become available immediately in a provisional form
>> (this is what we had actually been actually asking the BfS to do, as
>> there is no clear reason to wait till the "official" v!
>>   ersion
>> is prepared
>> by swisstopo, however they hadn't responded in a positive way).
>>
>> The downside is that, beside swisstopo and the BfS creating the
>> impression of a not really well thought out, rather uncoordinated
>> effort, it is currently not clear what the actual licence/use conditions
>> are (there are lots of links being sent around which lead to
>> conflicting, sometimes year old information). We'll see if we can
>> clarify this next week.
>>
>> I've generated a short comparison of where we are in OSM currently vs.
>> the GWR data:  http://qa.poole.ch/addresses/ch_canton
>>
>> Noteworthy points:
>>
>> - last year roughly end of the year we had  667'807 addresses vs.
>> 868'960 now, an increase of a good 120'000. Most of this is due to
>> Berne increasing from 88'817 to 190'243 (actually the very small
>> increase in the other cantons is slightly disappointing)
>> - th!
>>   e weak
>> cantons are those that we expected
>> - the GWR numbers are lower than those in the available cantonal
>> datasets mainly due to a more restrictive definition of what an address
>> is.
>>
>> As soon as we've clarified the licence situation, we can have a look
>> what the best way will be to utilize the data one way or another.
>>
>> Simon
>>
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