Hi Simon

I do not agree with you. In Germany a Fahrradstrasse (bicycle_road) is a street where bicycles have the priority. Normaly it is a highway=residential. Cars normaly are allowed. Some rare exceptions exist. Speed limit is not signed out but as far as I learned it is 30km/h. Pedestrians are not allowed.

Nope.

See https://dejure.org/gesetze/StVO/Anlage_2.html

Neither Radwege nor Radstrassen allow other traffic without explicit signage including pedestrians, they are dedicated bicycle infrastructure. Because they are typically wider it is simply possible to allow car traffic which on your typical German Radweg wouldn't work :-).

However I didn't want to start a discussion on the fine points of German traffic laws (which will take a decade or so), it is just clear that the Swiss Velostrasse -doesn't indicate dedicated bicycle infrastructure.

Simon

Urs

Am 6. September 2021 10:38:16 MESZ schrieb Simon Poole <simon@poole.ch>:

Since the beginning of this year Switzerland so called "Velostrassen" 
are a thing, these are simply streets in 30km/h zones with priority for 
bicycles instead of the right before left regime in such zones.

This is at least similar to the situation in Belgium (legally) and some 
other countries (informally) where similar concepts exist, in BE, NL and 
so on such streets are tagged with cyclestreet=yes.

This is however different to the German concept of "Fahrradstrassen" 
which are wider bicycle paths on which pedestrian use is allowed and you 
have to ride on the right (with other words essentially a normal 
"Veloweg" in Switzerland). "Fahrradstrassen" are tagged with 
bicycle_road=yes and IMHO that should always be on a highway=cycleway.

I would suggest that in Switzerland we should use cyclestreet=yes as 
this models the legal situation here better than the German 
bicycle_road=yes and would document that in the wiki in the appropriate 
places if there is no big protest.

Further I've noticed that there is small number of uses of bicycle_road 
in Switzerland 
(http://overpass-turbo.osm.ch/?q=LyoKVGhpcyBoYcSGYmVlbiBnxI1lcmF0ZWQgYnkgdGhlIG92xJJwxIlzLXR1cmJvIHdpemFyZC7EgsSdxJ9yaWdpbmFsIHNlxLBjaMSsxIk6CsOiwoDCnGJpY3ljbGVfcm9hZD0qIMS6IFPErXR6xJJsYW5kxYjCnQoqLwpbb3V0Ompzb25dW3RpbWXFrMWuMjVdOwovLyBmZXTFgiDEsMWAIMWIwpzFnGnFnsWgxaLFpMKAwp3Em8SrxL_FgcWDxLoKe3vEkG9jb2RlQXLFgDrGjsaQcsWhxaN9fS0-LsaYcsWCxqXFgMW_xoHEj8SUxJ1yIMamc3VsdHMKKAogIMa5cXXEksSaxKNydMaDb3I6xovFicWLxY3Fj8WRxZPFlcWXxaXHhyBuxqJlWyLHmMWOxZDFksWUZCJdKMaJYcayxYDGtGjGtmEpxb_HiHdhecelx6fHmseqxZXHrcevxqbHscazxrXIhce4x6DGpsWhxbbFsse-xYzHqMebx6vIg8ewx7LGmce2yIrIisa5cMS3bseRxr_HgceDCsW6xJjGonnFvz7Fv8ilc2tlxL1xdDs&c=BMv3wQkgfI&R) 
that I suspect are either actually a Velostrasse or are mistagged due to 
an issue with the JOSM preset for bicycle road that might have been used 
outside of DE. These should naturally be checked and changed to 
cyclestreet=yes if we have a consensus on the matter.

Simon

_______________________________________________
talk-ch mailing list
talk-ch@openstreetmap.ch
http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch