[talk-ch] Local rules for Wikidata/Wikipedia

Mateusz Konieczny matkoniecz at tutanota.com
Wed Nov 16 10:02:01 CET 2022




14 lis 2022, 11:46 od lonvia at denofr.de:

> Hi,
>
> On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 10:46:03AM +0100, Mateusz Konieczny wrote:
>
>> For me main benefits are
>> - of adding wikipedia tag: data becomes human readable
>> - of adding wikidata tag: makes easier to fix wikipedia tag in case where
>> Wikidata editors decided to rename article (moves related to dashes, emdashes,
>> brackets and similar are really liked by some)
>>
>> See 
>> https://matkoniecz.github.io/OSM-wikipedia-tag-validator-reports/Schweiz%20-%20Suisse%20-%20Svizzera%20-%20Svizra%20(Switzerland%20-%20Szwajcaria)%20-%20obvious.html#wikipedia%20wikidata%20mismatch%20-%20follow%20wikipedia%20redirect
>> that could be fixed with automatic edit rather with manual one thanks
>> to presence of wikidata confirming the target of redirect.
>>
>
> Not all redirects are bad and should be automatically replaced. Sometimes they
> are there for a reason.
>
> Example: the hamlet of Hurnen
> In OSM: https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/3099480616
>
> It has a wikipedia tag of de:Hurnen, which is fine. It can be considered a
> placeholder for its own page which at the moment still redirects to the
> page of Eschlikon, which it is part from.
>
> The wikidata tag was derived automatically from the wikipedia tag not
> taking this situation into account. So it's not a reliable source.
>
> The correct handling here would be to delete the wikidata tag.
>
> NB: the fact that the wikidata page has Hurnen and Wallenwil as
> alternative names of Eschlikon makes me seriously question the usefuleness of
> wikidata.
>
oh, there are several things to unpack here:

- so, I think that this wikidata tag should be remove as clearly invalid

- I think that wikipedia tag is also invalid - we should link articles that actually
exist not articles not yet created - with neither redirects nor nonexisting
nor deleted titles being a valid target

- bot edit that edit wikidata tag was simply wrong and invalid and mistaken
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/52343388 was made 5 years ago
but I am still tempted to revert it where possible

Adding wikidata matching redirect target is a bad idea and obviously results in
adding incorrect data, as some redirects point to more general articles.




So in this case I would want to remove both wikipedia and wikidata tag.

And check whether Eschlikon is linked from Eschlikon OSM object (
https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/30152663 or
https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/1684519 may match)




And yes, wikidata is hideously unreliable. It is useful as stable id for
wikipedia article titles, for storing links between wikipedia articles
in different languages and their Wikimedia Commons category.

For everything else it is not really reliable and you run into many
problems where trying to use it (there are many reasons for that
but quality is markedly lower than for example OSM or Wikipedia)
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