[talk-ch] Draft changes for the hiking network wiki page

René Buffat buffat at gmail.com
Wed Sep 29 21:01:13 CEST 2021

Salut Raphael

This is indeed not clear from the draft description. I will try to update
it to make it more clear. In general with most of the existing relations
there is only one relation between two signposts. In rare cases there are
hiking routes that are signed in only one direction. In these cases, based
on Michael Spreng`s advice, I put a signed_direction=yes (e.g. [1]).

Mapping hiking times was also already previously mentioned. I'm not sure
what the best way would be to map them. Typically, hiking times on
guideposts are shown to a selection of "hiking destinations". The closest
destination is not necessarily the next guidepost with a white label. In
Ticino I saw that somebody mapped hiking times [2], but to be honest I do
not yet fully understand how this works.

Personally, I'm not sure if I would map hiking times. From my experience, I
prefer using apps such as the "Berner Wanderplaner" or the new swisstopo
app that estimates the hiking time using the route and elevation data and
allows to adjust the hiking speed according to my fitness.

I was not aware of yway.ch. I assume nobody was in contact with them
before. A tool to collect guidepost photos would be quite nice. I assume
I'm not the only one with a lot of guidepost photos on his phone.

lg rene

[1] https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/1437462
[2] https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/4593590352

On Wed, 29 Sept 2021 at 13:59, Raphaël Terrettaz <r.terrettaz at gmail.com>

> Hello,
> I've tried to create a hiking route using the information in the document.
> I have 3 questions:
> - Should I create 2 relationships between each signpost? One in one
> direction, and a second by reversing the from and the to?
> - Is it possible to add to the relation the time indicated on the
> guidpost? It would be very useful data to show on a hiking map. But the
> "duration" tag should not be used for this (ref.
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Relation:route). Did you know of
> another tag that might be suitable (assuming that the times will not be the
> same depending on the direction of the path).
> - Do you Knowles if it’s possible to use data of the « www.yway.ch »
> website? Has anyone already contacted the administrator?
> Thank you !
> Raphael Terrettaz
> Le dim. 19 sept. 2021 à 15:02, René Buffat <buffat at gmail.com> a écrit :
>> Dear All
>> Since after the online meeting a while ago I tried to formulate a draft
>> based on the discussions on the mailing list / the meeting. Due to lack of
>> time and energy, this took unfortunately a lot longer than I initially
>> thought.
>> The current draft can be found here
>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RIn4vOpPggEzJOv9AMl1egxzeMLpkgxF0q8nWuFhUaE/edit?usp=sharing
>> Unfortunately, I can't send the PDF version (for people that do not want
>> to access a google server) to the mailing list, as it is too big. But I'm
>> open to suggestions for alternatives.
>> If you like, please create comments directly in the document or reply to
>> this email when you have feedback. The idea would be to collect all
>> discussion points at the bottom of the document and mark the discussed
>> parts of the document with comments.
>> When writing the draft, I had the following thoughts:
>>    -  It would be could to include some background information about the
>>    Swiss hiking network as this could give some context for the rest of the
>>    document and might facilitate discussions about the topic.
>>    - There are different opinions on what level of detail the hiking
>>    network should be mapped. It is thus important to clearly state a minimal
>>    goal but also allow some flexibility.
>>    - Changes to the wiki page should not contradict existing mapped
>>    relations, except there are good reasons for it (such as e.g. the issue
>>    with using name tags for relations that clash with nominatim)
>>    - Figures are sometimes better to explain things than text.
>>    - For some regions, open datasets exist that contain the hiking
>>    network but no information about guideposts. These datasets should be
>>    usable.
>> lg rene
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