[talk-ch] Changes to HikingNetwork wiki page

michael spreng mailinglist at osm.datendelphin.net
Thu Jul 15 07:44:24 CEST 2021


This has been done from the start of this whole discussion, with
exception of those who were already known to be active recently on the
mailinglist.

Michael

On 14.07.21 22:34, René Buffat wrote:
> I would suggest to contact the most active mappers (that contributed
> during the last 1-2 years to the hiking network) with direct messages. I
> assume most of these mappers are not necessarily subscribed to this
> mailing list or present at a Stammtisch.
> 
> lg rene
> 
> On Wed, 14 Jul 2021 at 14:41, michael spreng
> <mailinglist at osm.datendelphin.net
> <mailto:mailinglist at osm.datendelphin.net>> wrote:
> 
>     Hi René
> 
>     You are setting a lot of pressure on me personally. I humbly started out
>     to tackle this topic as an all-round mapper. A kind of moderator. Having
>     mapped hiking routes as I encountered them since quite a few years. But
>     of course nothing compared to you.
> 
>     Your hand hovering above the nuclear button of a revert is duly noted.
> 
>     I also get the impression that the mailing list is now only turning
>     around each individual with roundabout statements. While the initial
>     discussion was fruitful and informative, I now get nothing of substance
>     that I could use to improve the situation further, especially on such
>     short notice.
> 
>     I like the proposal to discuss this in a meeting, and encourage everyone
>     to participate
> 
>     https://cloud.sosm.ch/index.php/apps/polls/s/Oi42HVw6gsR6L0mD
>     <https://cloud.sosm.ch/index.php/apps/polls/s/Oi42HVw6gsR6L0mD>
>     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Switzerland:Z%C3%BCrich/OSM-Treffen#130._OSM-Stammtisch_Juli_.28tbd..29_2021
>     <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Switzerland:Z%C3%BCrich/OSM-Treffen#130._OSM-Stammtisch_Juli_.28tbd..29_2021>
> 
>     Michael
> 
>     On 14.07.21 06:31, René Buffat wrote:
>     > Dear Stefan
>     >
>     > Can you elaborate on what exactly is broken that should have been
>     fixed
>     > by the recent changes?
>     1: Name tag, 2: It was self contradicting for named guide posts
>     >
>     > For me, it seems as the recent changes of the wiki are pushed by
>     people
>     > not involved, or only recently involved in mapping hiking routes.
>     >
>     > I think everyone agrees that the current state of the Wiki is not
>     > optimal. But before significant changes are made these should be
>     > discussed with the community that is actively mapping hiking
>     routes. It
>     > is pointless to change the wiki when the active contributors are not
>     > aware of the changes or were not involved in these discussions.
>     >
>     > As far as I'm aware is the person that created the wiki entry has not
>     > been actively involved in mapping hiking routes since at least a few
>     > years ago.
>     >
>     > lg rene
>     >  
>     >
>     > On Wed, 14 Jul 2021 at 00:51, Stefan Keller <sfkeller at gmail.com
>     <mailto:sfkeller at gmail.com>
>     > <mailto:sfkeller at gmail.com <mailto:sfkeller at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>     >
>     >     Dear René, lieber René
>     >
>     >     Bitte mach das nicht. Dem Edit ist einige Diskussion
>     vorausgegangen
>     >     u.a. mit denjenigen, die die Wiki-Seite erstellt haben.
>     >     Pls. don't do that because the way currently hiking routes are
>     >     tagged is broken.
>     >     Let's talk in person in order to explain the reasons e.g. at next
>     >     Zürcher OSM-Treffen? .
>     >     Are you available this thursday or friday?
>     >     See
>     >   
>      https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Switzerland:Z%C3%BCrich/OSM-Treffen#130._OSM-Stammtisch_Juli_.28tbd..29_2021
>     <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Switzerland:Z%C3%BCrich/OSM-Treffen#130._OSM-Stammtisch_Juli_.28tbd..29_2021>
>     >   
>      <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Switzerland:Z%C3%BCrich/OSM-Treffen#130._OSM-Stammtisch_Juli_.28tbd..29_2021
>     <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Switzerland:Z%C3%BCrich/OSM-Treffen#130._OSM-Stammtisch_Juli_.28tbd..29_2021>>
>     >
>     >     Liebe Grüsse, Stefan
>     >
>     >     Am Di., 13. Juli 2021 um 20:41 Uhr schrieb René Buffat
>     >     <buffat at gmail.com <mailto:buffat at gmail.com>
>     <mailto:buffat at gmail.com <mailto:buffat at gmail.com>>>:
>     >     >
>     >     > The recent changes of the wiki do not reflect how currently
>     hiking
>     >     routes are tagged and do not reflect the status of the discussion
>     >     here on the mailing list. I will revert them at the end of this
>     >     week, but I hope the author of the changes will do it earlier.
>     >     >
>     >     > lg rene
>     >     >
>     >     > On Sun, 11 Jul 2021 at 14:13, Stefan Keller
>     <sfkeller at gmail.com <mailto:sfkeller at gmail.com>
>     >     <mailto:sfkeller at gmail.com <mailto:sfkeller at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>     >     >>
>     >     >> Dear Michael, dear all
>     >     >>
>     >     >> Thanks, Michael, for your proposal and the changes in the
>     Wiki [1].
>     >     >> I just wanted to support these changes as you announced in this
>     >     thread.
>     >     >> We really need a base network for hiking which is routable!
>     >     >> These changes don't exclude the many named routes mappers are
>     >     eager to
>     >     >> add (as relations) on top of that proper base network.
>     >     >>
>     >     >> ~Stefan
>     >     >>
>     >     >> [1]
>     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Switzerland/HikingNetwork
>     <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Switzerland/HikingNetwork>
>     >     <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Switzerland/HikingNetwork
>     <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Switzerland/HikingNetwork>>
>     >     >>
>     >     >> Am Sa., 26. Juni 2021 um 11:32 Uhr schrieb michael spreng
>     >     >> <mailinglist at osm.datendelphin.net
>     <mailto:mailinglist at osm.datendelphin.net>
>     >     <mailto:mailinglist at osm.datendelphin.net
>     <mailto:mailinglist at osm.datendelphin.net>>>:
>     >     >> >
>     >     >> > Hallo Urs
>     >     >> >
>     >     >> > On 23.06.21 20:02, Flips wrote:
>     >     >> > > Die Info zum Stammtisch habe ich jetzt zu spät gelesen.
>     >     Vielleicht beim
>     >     >> > > nächsten Mal.
>     >     >> >
>     >     >> > Also um 20:00 Uhr waren wir noch lange nicht fertig :)
>     >     >> >
>     >     >> > >
>     >     >> > > Ich sehe die Routen nicht sls technische Routen,
>     sondern als
>     >     offizielle
>     >     >> > > Routen. Warum sonst gibt es auf den Wegweisern Endziele mit
>     >     Zeitangaben
>     >     >> > > und von einigen Wegweiserstandorten aus Routen über
>     >     verschiedene Wege
>     >     >> > > zum selben Ziel. Dies wäre oftmals gar nicht nötig, um das
>     >     ganze Netz
>     >     >> > > abzubilden, da schon andere Routen die selben
>     >     Streckenabschnitte abdecken.
>     >     >> > >
>     >     >> > > Wenn das Wanderwegnetz nur als Netz ohne Routen verstanden
>     >     wird, dann
>     >     >> > > sollten, wie ich es schon in einem vorherigen Mail
>     >     beschrieben habe,
>     >     >> > > einzig die lcn=yes zu den highway=* dazugetagt werden.
>     In OSM
>     >     sollten
>     >     >> > > nur echte Routen als Relationen gemapt werden.
>     >     >> > > Die from/to-tags werde ich künftig gerne berücksichtigen.
>     >     >> >
>     >     >> > Das würde technisch verhindern, dass eine way mehrmals vor
>     >     kommt. Aber:
>     >     >> > Es gibt einen starken Bruch zwischen Regionen, wo es keine
>     >     "referenz"
>     >     >> > (Name, Nummer, was auch immer) gibt für die Komponenten des
>     >     Basisnetz
>     >     >> > (CH), und Regionen, wo es das eben gibt. Sarah hat da am
>     >     Stammtisch ein
>     >     >> > Beispiel gezeigt für letzteres. Und man verliert die
>     >     Möglichkeit, das
>     >     >> > from/to zu tagen für den Unterhalt, was ein grosses
>     Anliegen zu
>     >     sein
>     >     >> > scheint.
>     >     >> >
>     >     >> > Grüsse
>     >     >> > Michael
>     >     >> > _______________________________________________
>     >     >> > talk-ch mailing list
>     >     >> > talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch
>     <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch> <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch
>     <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch>>
>     >     >> > http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>
>     >     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>>
>     >     >> _______________________________________________
>     >     >> talk-ch mailing list
>     >     >> talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch>
>     <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch>>
>     >     >> http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>
>     >     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>>
>     >     >
>     >     > _______________________________________________
>     >     > talk-ch mailing list
>     >     > talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch>
>     <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch>>
>     >     > http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>
>     >     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>>
>     >     _______________________________________________
>     >     talk-ch mailing list
>     >     talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch>
>     <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch>>
>     >     http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>
>     >     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>>
>     >
>     >
>     > _______________________________________________
>     > talk-ch mailing list
>     > talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch>
>     > http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>
>     >
>     _______________________________________________
>     talk-ch mailing list
>     talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch <mailto:talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch>
>     http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
>     <http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch>
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> talk-ch mailing list
> talk-ch at openstreetmap.ch
> http://lists.openstreetmap.ch/mailman/listinfo/talk-ch
> 


More information about the talk-ch mailing list